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HerkPFE

New Tanker

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Only question I have is when do we take off the America Flag on our uniforms and replace it with the French flag?? I\'d rather put our tax dollars in American pockets.

My 2 cents

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I hope Boeing fights it in court. That so-called Grumman (EADS) airplane is in reality an Airbus-330. It will create about 2000 jobs in Mobile Al.where it will be assembled, whereas if Boeing (767) had gotten it, it would have created approx 44,000 AMERICAN jobs from 300 suppliers and Boeing in 40 states!!!The FRENCH, GERMANS and BRITS get the 44,000 jobs. Just remember if the FRENCH don\'t like our policies they don\'t send us any SPARE PARTS....and they usually don\'t !!! Also the 767 is closer to the size of a KC-135. The 330 is 35% larger and 20% heavier and this means access to less runways/airports than the 767. 767 burns 24% less fuel per minute than the 330, thats approx $10 Billion in life cycle savings. WHAT WERE THESE PEOPLE THINKING?? (ie. JOHN MCCAIN) !!! : Bill

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I\'ll be the first to say I don\' think there is a legitimate company out there any more in the aviation field. I know these are different airframes, but you have to look within each company to see what is really going on.

Boeing\'s new 787...75% of it is made overseas then flown into Boeing field for assembly (include Airbus). They are having the same problem (I mean push backs) as Airbus with the A380.

Speaking of the Airbus\' A380...over 50% of it is made in the USA with local company and shipped back to France for assembly.

So when we say \"all\" jobs are running overseas...that isn\'t the case. Maybe we all need to look into the real deal is.

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Whatever happened to BUY AMERICAN. $135M per 767 VS $160M per 330. EADS is bragging about their IFR boom having flown 50 times..hmmm Boeings boom flown..oh bout 40 YEARS..yep give me the EADS boom...right! Bill

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Sounds like AF is running scared after they tried to do the under-the-table lease deal with Boeing for the 767 tanker a few years back. Airbus threatened to go to court, AF found some shaky dealings between Boeing and a super-grade civil servant, and canceled the deal. Now it sounds like \"make nice\" time to the French now that Sarkozy is in charge over there.

The A-330 is a nice airplane if you like airplanes driven by five computers that can\'t be over-ridden. You\'d probably never need to exceed the programmed aircraft operating parameters; however, even if you needed to in a severe emergency situation, the computers won\'t allow it.

Bad deal for the US. If it ain\'t Boeing, I ain\'t going.

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I\'m hoping that somehow this will turn positive for Boeing. By that, I mean change the corporate mentality that has caused them to lose two huge contracts in recent memory (KC-X and JSF).

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\"Airbus threatened to go to court, AF found some shaky dealings between Boeing and a super-grade civil servant, and canceled the deal.

There was also a female Col. and several AF military folks that were nailed for shady dealings.

Take it from somebody that does maintenance on both Boeing and ScareBus

Aircraft...the thought that comes to my mind is like comparing a 1969 Toyota to a 1969 Ford Galaxy. The Toyota was a good car for 50K in mileage then you threw it away...the ford could go 100K in mileage with the right care. I have worked Heavy Maintenance on the A-319/320 and it is a ten year aircraft.

Just my two cents

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The RAAF is buying the KC-30 (A330 MRTT) along with the RAF and UAE, and they also looked at the KC-767 which Italy and Japan will operate. I believe one reason Airbus won the RAAF deal was the extra cargo space in the KC-30 and the fact that the 767 is a old airframe about to be replaced by the 787. The A330 is still in production and selling strong. This meant that spares may be an issue in years to come along with manufacturer support.

I am surprised to see Airbus win the contract as Boeing could certainly provide jobs etc in the US but i think the old tanker contract and the coruption that went with it may have killed Boeings chances.

I do find it strange the Mobile is the site for building the aircraft when no aircraft are currently built there. Where do they get the people to build it from?

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About 400 miles different, Crash. I don\'t think illegals would be very concerned about that. Grumman will get workers from the same place they always do--locals. The workforce will be trained by qualified folks coming from everywhere else in the country.

Boeing did this to themselves, plain and simple. They got greedier and it bit them. Now, Airbus will reap the reward for Boeing\'s corrupt dealings.

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The thing that bothers me isn\'t losing my job, but the precedance that was set by:

1. Buying the Falcon for the Coast Guard from outside the U.S.

2. Buying the Dolphin for the Coast Guard from outside the U.S.

3. Buying the replacement for the H-3 for the Presidential fleet from outside the U.S.

4. Now, the tanker from outside the U.S.

This is a direct slap in the face to EACH AND EVERY AMERICAN and should not be tolerated. Send all of your rep\'s an e-mail. Send the White House e-mails. Hell, send e-mails to the SecDef, SecAF, anyone that has some pull. We as a collective need to stop the sell-out of America!

Starting yesterday, I am not buying anything that is not assembled by American workers. If a country has their tech support outside the U.S., I refuse to deal with them and am sending their corporate folks e-mails. It\'s time to retake our country.

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Timcoppin...you might want to rethink your \"only American assembled thing\". You will be suprised by what is left after you look at all the MADE IN CHINA tabs.

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Hence the problem. Hey, if I got to do without, so be it. I do know that as long as we as Americans continue to send our manufacturing overseas, we\'re in real trouble. Does anyone remember what got us (the Allies) thru WW2? It wasn\'t France building the best airplanes, China building the cheapest widget, Mexico building the trucks. No, it was the U.S. Industry building most of the equipment for all the Allies, including the USSR. We as a society need to reset the pride that this country used to have. If that doesn\'t happen, God only knows what will happen.

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http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/07/05/business/eads.php

Here\'s another reason not to buy Boeing tankers. It looks to me that EADS has some real problems, like delayed delieverly of Airbus\', insider trading, pissed off shareholders and few assorted hicups. With the Euro being so strong against the dollar buying EADS could cost a bundle when the currency refloats to its real value. So I take back my suggestion.

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I was at the 5-sided puzzle palace in the early 80s. The Hill wouldn\'t allow us to buy anything that wasn\'t made in the US, no matter if we could get a better/cheaper product. Now the \"global economy\" instituted by Bush 41/Clinton dictates our purchases.

The Airbus tactic to weasel into the airplane market is their \"give away/throw away\" airframes.

I wonder what\'ll happen when AF needs lots of spare parts really quick for the new tankers. Can you say \"delays, delays, delays\" and \"pay thru the nose?\"

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I can remember a while back when I was doing a good bit of international travel (commercial flights) on Gov\'t contracts, our Gov\'t contract administrator insisted that all travel be on U.S. airlines; always stay in U.S. franchised hotels, and buy U.S. was the rule.

It\'s hard to believe that our U.S. Gov\'t Acquisition experts are going to throw this large contract to procure an airplane from a country who has not been a supporter of U.S. policy. Who is heading up this competition? The Taliban????

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My 2 cents

Boeing screwed themselves with the Darlene Drunion deal. A combo USAF/A5 and Boeing fiasco which did themselves in on this deal. Same players on CSAR-X as well.

What can we expect next, well first, the GAO will have to do a investigation. Boeing will not take this lying down. We will end up waiting another few years (like CSAR-X) before the dust settles. In the mean time, the 135 fleet continues to age and our war fighters will have less capability.

Question: Why we could not go get more Low time DC-10\'s from Mojave and make \'em KC-10s? Ohh thats right, it would make to much sense and save to much freaking money.

Whats next? Lockheed moves production of the J models to China or India. Yeesh.

Herkeng

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Maybe we could replace the F-15\'s with Eurofighters, and isn\'t russia building a new transport to go against the C-130? Maybe we could buy some of those to replace our E models and older H models. Shoot, maybe we could even outsource our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan!

Sorry for the sarcasm, I think Boeing got a bum deal!

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I think Boeing sat on its fat arse assuming the deal was theirs...

The more I read about all of this, the more I agree that the NG/EADS offers more performance. Now, I don\'t know jack about the MX side of it, nor the life-cycle of these airplanes, so I think that should play in as well.

Here\'s a different viewpoint than the \'woe is me\' Boeing version...granted, it\'s the WA Post, but...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/06/AR2008030603752.html

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Boeing may be whiners but they are OUR whiners. You are correct US Herk, the maint end WILL be a nightmare for a long time. Let\'s see....where is my METRIC wrench to tighten this METRIC clamp that holds this METRIC hose to this METRIC fitting. Sure, you can change the units tools over to METRIC tools and change their benchstock over to METRIC bolts, nuts ect., but what happens when you land at a non-airbus base and you need some enroute support. You wont feel the pain while you are in crew rest but old Joe bag-o-donuts Crew chief will be scrambling!!! The work will get done, it always does, but for a long time it will be painful...I know cause I\'ve been there and done that. This deal still sucks!!! Bill:angry:

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