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Taiwan C-130 Crash 1965

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Does any one have information on the reason a C-130 crashed on 12 Dec 1965 in Taiwan? Where was its destination?.

There was also a small landing strip East of Hsinchu Taiwan on the side of a hill or mountain, where the c squadron would sometimes fly to. Time frame 70-75. Any information on this location would be helpful.

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I LOST MY BUDDY,SGT.ALAN MARTIN C/C,AC.#UNNOWN (I FORGET),C-130E DOWN APPROCH END. WX.=PILOT ORDERED TO DIVERT TO KADENA, A/C ORBITED FIELD 1-HOURE , FUEL STARVATION ON APPROCH, CAME IN RIGHT OF RUN WAY APROUCH. WING CAME IN CONT.RT.TIPE=SHERED WING, A/C THEN FLIPED ON BACK,CAME TO REAST BOTTEM'S UP.BURNING MOSTLY INTEREOR.12 R&R TROOPS DOA.+ CREW TWO WERE TAKEN OUT PUT IN HOSP.MEDIVACED TO JAPAN, DIED IN ROUTE. A-MEN GOD REAST THER SOUL'S.

ALLEN KC8QZQ LATE FEB.1969 OR EARLY MARCH 1969

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Are you sure of the date? There are no records of a lost Herk on 12/12/65 in Taiwan.

There was one 12/12/65 in Germany.

There may have been an accident in Taiwan on that date that the airplane was repaired and flown out?

That was before the E models moved to CCK but of course the USAF landed in Taiwan before then.

I have records of 4 Herk crashes on Taiwan

6 Sep 66 63-7878

8 Mar 69 64-0545

15 Dec 69 62-1800

2 Oct 70 64-0536

Bob

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I was at CCK and remember seeing 545. The crew chief had so much pride in it that he had a cover made for the backrest on the lower bunk that read "fly with pride on 545". This airplane had also carried Bob Hope and his show on one flight to Vietnam. The C/C was not on that flight as I met him years later when Savannah transitioned from C124 to the Herk E's.

He was there conducting a FTD class and we met again.

Larry

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Sorry guys.

The date was Oct 2, 1970 64-0536 CN 4025.

After take of from Sun Shan airport in Taipei, Taiwan crashed into Cha Tien Shan (Cha Tien Mountain) 18.6 miles away at an altitude of 2,831 feet.

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I am very familiar with that crash...It was on a sortie to go from CCK to Taipei airport and bring new assignees to CCK who had arrived either comercial from the states or from snake school in the PI. They took off from Taipei and missed a turn at one check point and flew into the mountain. Weather was lousey and it took several days to locate the wreckage.

Killed a bunch of great guys...something like 35-to 45 people.

Reason I am familiar is that I was in that class at snake school at Clark and after finishing school we had a few days to goof off before our 727 flight to Taipei. Well I ran out of cash

and got a hop two days before the rest of the group, got to Taipei and then cought a train to Taichung. Many folks were asking where the group was and it was several days before we got the bad news.

Muff

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I too am familiar with that flight. As was mentioned, the flight was a regularly scheduled pax run from Taipei to CCKAB. Exactly a year earlier I was on that run, a new 3-level out of Tech School (Keesler AFB) assigned to the 314th AMS. After that crash the run was eliminated and everyone came down-country by train or bus, as I recall. Frank, God was really looking after you!

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If I remember correctly the pilot was Major Ronald Shelton. He was the commander of the 50th OMS. He was trying to get his flight time in.

I had just left CCK on the 16th of September. I arrived in Albuquerque on the 3rd or 4th of October. I got a call on the 5th from a friend I knew in California that knew I was to rotate about that time. That is when I found out about the crash.

I was quite sad as I knew him fairly well.

Wil

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64-0536 was a CCK local that was diverted to Taipei to pick up pax.

Major Ronald Stelter was a Nav.

The AC was an IP Major Mayer, CP lt Thomas, the FE Sgt Ehle and LM A1C Wilson Crew chief A1C Bosnick

They took off with a clearance to 3000 climb to six after the first fix. They never climbed passed three, they were called and did not acknowledge climbing to 6. Hit the mountain at 3000 feet. Basically crew error, did not follow their clearance, in their defence the nav aids in Taipei were notoriously crappy.

After that every crew had to get a Taipei check with an IP before they went alone.

I gave lots of Taipei checks and one of the only three guys I ever flunked, flunked the Taipei check. He had already busted twice with two other IP's-No situational awareness, matter of fact no awareness at all.

Bob

The others:

63-7878 reported over a beacon but was 13 1/2 miles right of the beacon and hit a mountain

64-0545 crashed short of the runway trying to land below minimums.

62-1800 crew said "runaway prop" Board said crack in prop dome assembly

I Forgot 62-1805 that ended up in the ater off Makung, there was a lot of controversy over the cause of that one. prop I think, Muff may know.

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Bob, I was reminded of the 64-536 crash vividly a couple weeks ago. I was visiting Taiwan and my brother in law had arranged a 6 day tour for us in China. We flew out of the old Taipei airport...heavy overcast, rain, all the usual February bad weather....all I could think of was that 536 crash and the loss of all those friends.

As for 6201805 at Makung, the accident board ruled it as being caused by over heated brakes causing a blown main tire which must have penetrated the fuselarge and caused the plane to crash. They had been doing touch and goes at the strip on Makung and the Col who was assigned as the accident board president who was not very familiar with the C-130 and had just been assigned to Clark AB shortly prior to the crash and had not gotten settled there and wanted to quickly finish the investigation and go home.

I spent 5 days at Makung and on a sea going Navy tug boat and made several SCUBA dives to the wreckage (75-90 feet down) I took the under water photos that were submitted with the accident report. We only dove on the main wreckage area, looked like a broken plate on a cement floor except for the tail section.

The mine sweeper that was there helping with the search located a large piece of what was thought to be part of the wreckage about 1000 yards away from the main wreckage site. We never were allowed to dive that area as the Colonel thought that he had enough evidance from the site where we dove.

I believe that was the nose/flight deck section and I was really pissed as several of the crew bodies were never recovered....I thought they might have been in that piece of wreckage.

I made my thoughts known to the wing commander and to the follow up collateral board but my thoughts were disregarded. I'm still pissed about it.

Muff Millen

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The Board President on 1805 was Col Stanley Bailey.

Reg Manning who is on the site sometimes led the search and recovery team on 536.

Bob

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64-0536 was a CCK local that was diverted to Taipei to pick up pax.

Major Ronald Stelter was a Nav.

The AC was an IP Major Mayer, CP lt Thomas, the FE Sgt Ehle and LM A1C Wilson Crew chief A1C Bosnick

They took off with a clearance to 3000 climb to six after the first fix. They never climbed passed three, they were called and did not acknowledge climbing to 6. Hit the mountain at 3000 feet. Basically crew error, did not follow their clearance, in their defence the nav aids in Taipei were notoriously crappy.

After that every crew had to get a Taipei check with an IP before they went alone.

I gave lots of Taipei checks and one of the only three guys I ever flunked, flunked the Taipei check. He had already busted twice with two other IP's-No situational awareness, matter of fact no awareness at all.

Bob

The others:

63-7878 reported over a beacon but was 13 1/2 miles right of the beacon and hit a mountain

64-0545 crashed short of the runway trying to land below minimums.

62-1800 crew said "runaway prop" Board said crack in prop dome assembly

I Forgot 62-1805 that ended up in the ater off Makung, there was a lot of controversy over the cause of that one. prop I think, Muff may know.

Bob

7878 wasn't that the bird in Jan 71? If so I was the normal CP for that crew. However, the AC had just upgraded to IP and was assigned a AC upgrade on that flight. He told me I wouldn't get in the seat and could stay home. As my wife had just arrived for a 30 day visite I elected not to fly that night.

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I was LUCKY-- I had a Port Call from McCord either 29 or 30 Sept. 1970 for CCK. Two days prior, I received a call from McCord Pax service asking if I would delay my port call 7 days, that they had "Over booked", & had to delay several Pax. Of course I said Yes, so I left either Oct. 6 or 7; got to Taipei the 9th. Otherwise I probably would have been on 64-536. Guess it just wasn't my time. I didn't hear about 536 until I had been on station a week or more.

And they did have a C130 waiting at Taipei to take us to CCK.

Glenn

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Skip

7878 was Sep 66 AC was Capt Shinn

0545 was Mar 69 AC was Maj Long an IP

1800 was Dec 69 AC was Capt Vogt an IP

0536 was Oct 70 AC was Maj Mayer an IP

1805 was Jun 72 AC was Capt Olson an IP

Bob

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Bob, if IP stands for Instructor Pilot your list shows 4 out of 5 had IP's on them. That's kind of scary.

Wil

Wil

Not that unusual for IP's to be aboard accident aircraft. Sometimes the IP is either not in the seat or does not react to a student mistake. Other times too high a self estimate of the IP's own abilities, leads them into something stupid.

Bob

Bob

Thanks for clearing that up. As I said thats kind of scary. Then again we were young and stupid.

Wil

Edited by bobdaley

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Skip

7878 was Sep 66 AC was Capt Shinn

0545 was Mar 69 AC was Maj Long an IP

1800 was Dec 69 AC was Capt Vogt an IP

0536 was Oct 70 AC was Maj Mayer an IP

1805 was Jun 72 AC was Capt Olson an IP

Bob

Thanks Bob it was Maj Mayer I found it in my flight book I kept.

Skip when you asked about jan 71, I thought you were at the 37th by then?

Bob

Edited by bobdaley

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Hey guys, I am a relative of one of the members of that flight. His mother, my grandmother of 95 just passed and we found the telegrams to her and my grandfather informing them of my uncles death. My family (lots of cousins--who were all very young at the time) have lots of questions. Any chance I could call one of you guys and talk to you about this?

Andy

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Thanks Bob it was Maj Mayer I found it in my flight book I kept.

Skip when you asked about jan 71, I thought you were at the 37th by then?

Bob

Nope got to the 37th in late April that year

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Every time my plane would call in an IFE, my mind would be going over every inch of my preflight and I would start praying to God to get my crew down safe and not let it be my fault. Most CCs cared more for "their" crews than they let on and prayed never to miss something that would cause harm. I couldn't imagine being the CC on one of these planes that went down.

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LM A1C Wilson on 64-0536 was my older brother. He was ten days shy of his 21st birthday. I remember the night before my mom showed me a Spiro Agnew watch she had bought to mail out the next day for his birthday. I have that watch hanging on a wall in my home office. He was a great brother, friend, and mentor.

Thank you for the only detailed info I've been able to locate.

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I had a good friend Joe Spigone who was a replacement Nav for the 21st

Joe Spigone was in the other section of my nav school class. The other guy from our class that got that CCK assignment was Jeff Speetjens, as I recall. They were both passengers on the airplane that crashed fall of '70, enroute to their first ops assignment. If I'd known anything about anything at the time, I'd have tried hard for the CCK assignment when we made our choices. As it was, I stayed at Mather for NBT.

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