Guest Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 Hey everyone, 1st time poster. Anyway i was watching AFN and they had a piece on a new C-130 8 bladed prop that is being designed for the NY ANG flying the LC-130\'s. They said it was to help them by giving them more power/thrust for taking off in snow and to stop using the JATO rockets due to $$$. Can anyone shine more light on this development and does anyone know if these new props will go on E\'s and H\'s? I\'m guessing they will have to mod the valve housing alittle Thanks Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mongo Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 http://www.edwards.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123089573 This link has all the answeres you are looking for, and then some. even has some cool pics. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n1dp Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 I hope they don\'t run into the same stall characteristics the \"J\" ended up with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herkeng130 Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 What were the J Stall characteristics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n1dp Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 The \"J\" prop blows more air over the wing. During flight test, there was no buffet before the stall. They ended up having to install a stick shaker system. Angle of attack probe is mounted on the aft kick window blank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lkuest Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 I think it\'s cool the Air Force is finally buying off a little on the 8-bladed prop, but wouldn\'t it have been cheaper to borrow Snow Aviaton\'s aircraft rather than modding an H-model slick for the sole purpose of using it for test flights? Maybe they wanted to mod an H-model since the current LC-130\'s are H\'s, but I\'m sure they could have put -15\'s on the E-model already moded and still came up with some accurate flight charictaristics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Herk Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 This is rumor, mind you, and old rumor at that, that the J-model stick-shaker system is really a stick pusher system mandated by FAA due to excessively high AOA (which in turn was caused by increased airflow as you mention) during certification testing. Any J-model bubbas out there that can clarify? As for the multi-bladed props, I heard Snow\'s stuff was originally stiff-armed by USAF due to very high Vmca...again, rumor, but it wouldn\'t surprise me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NATOPS1 Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 The 8 blade prop is the follow-on to the EPC electronic valve housing..the ANG is putting lots of money into this and so...The more power thing is a not word for word accurate. The wing box is still limited in terms of MAX torque so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Herk Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 Ah, yes, but to be able to nearly always achieve 19.6K regardless of DA is a great thing... ...assuming it is able to. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsoto Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Hi Gang, I was one three AF FE\'s to serve with VXE-6 in Antartica (\'88-\'89 & \'89-\'90) During my time with VXE-6 we never used JATO, it was available if we needed it though. I am just curious if the NY ANG is using JATO in Antartica on a regular basis? I\'m glad the AF is testing the 8 bladed prop. I wish we had it when I was flying. Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Sounds like the 8-bladed prop would really help on those hot-day, high-elevation, heavyweight take-offs, too....but with today\'s awareness of center-wing structural limitations, over-torques may become more frequent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagebow Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Regarding the J stall characteristics, they are rather poor. Lockheed instructors (and its also mentioned in the fligh manual on memory)informed us that the J, due to new airflow characteristics caused by the new props, when stalled had a tendancy to roll towards inverted and onto its back. The stall warning system in the J is a three tier system. Audibal warning \"STALL, STALL, STALL\" followed by stick shaker if no action has been taken, then if the aircraft is still in danger, a stick pusher is activated to reduce the AOA. The AOA vane is used along with data from the ADC to allow the mission computer to initate the stall warning process. The system can be disabled by crew for when they are flying low level for example, although i think the audibal warning will occur either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC130LOAD1 Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 I can\'t figure out why the USAF/ANG is going to test the NP2000 propeller system on a non-ski equipped C-130 when the article states that the NP2000 is supposed to be for the LC-130\'s. Typical Air Force double speak.... \"We chose to use the (WYANG) aircraft because they are better suited for Edwards,\" he said. \"The New York planes are outfitted with skis and other equipment for Antarctica. Once we prove this works, we\'ll retrofit the (NYANG) C-130.\" I wonder if the non-USAF/ANG LC-130\'s (73-3300, 76-3301, 76-3302 and 93-1096) are going to get the NP2000 props. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPTestFE Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Because for the initial tests, a ski-equipped airplane isn\'t necessary & intruduces more logistical issues for the test team. Edwards AFB is not equipped to maintain C-130s...SPO issue there. The more basic you keep the airplane, the fewer parts we have to worry about waiting around to come in. We just waited over a week to get a motor here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPTestFE Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Snow Aviation modified their airframe to the point that any results they came up with were completely useless to us. If you look at pictures of the Snow aircraft, you\'ll notice that both the dorsal & rudder are quite abit larger than a regular Herc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herkeng130 Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 Here is the photo of the USAF herk with the NP2000 props... [img size=800]http://herkybirds.com/images/fbfiles/images/080305_F_3571D_009_sm.jpg View full size image here: http://www.herkybirds.com/coppermine/images/080305-F-3571D-009.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevoe Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Any news or new pictures? Regards Stephan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPTestFE Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 The performance results we\'re coming up with at this time do not seem to be even close to Hamilton Sundstrand\'s 25% guarantee. Next week we\'re de-modifying the aircraft & hopefully perform some of the same tests so that we can objectively compare numbers. Performance aside, I love the way this aircraft feels. The noise & vibration levels are reduced in a big way. Maintenance would benefit as well. There shouldn\'t be much of a reason to ever change the prop anymore until you have to pull the motor, due to the ability to change individual blades & the demonstrated reliability. Anyway, I wish I could make the call, but I can\'t. We\'ll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A97Stallion Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 was the aircraft de-mod\'d, how much was involved in this and is the testing still continuing to evalute the use of these prop\'s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HStech Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I demod\'d the aircraft last week to the 54H60 4-bladed EPCS configuration last week. EAFB will be performing baseline testing so they can run performance points using the same aircraft and get an \"apples to apples\" comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HStech Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Sorry for the double \"last week\" in my previous reply. I was multi-tasking while typing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A97Stallion Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 thanks for the info, anytime frame on the compleation of the \"apples for apples\" testing and wheather or not the NP2000 props are still being looked at for the LC130 Skl birds. is there much involed demod\'ing the aircraft, is it a case of once the aircraft has been mod\'d for the NP2000 prop it is relatitivly easy to swap between the 4 and the 8 bladed props cheers kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonnyJ Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 I attended one of Snow Avaition\'s customer brief\'s a couple years ago and they said they were on some of the initial tests at Edwards. I do seem to recall overhearing a side discussion about the Snow C-130\'s configuration (other mods Snow was pushing) that probably made the aircraft unsuitable for testing. This is old info and not sure if it is accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Miller Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I am wondering how many test flight did they do with the new prop and valve housing system installed before removing the prop. Also what kind of performance info did you gather on take off and landing and short field work besides cruise information. The reason I am asking it seems like they just finished hanging the props on and now you are taking them back off and when will the test data be released or can you give out some info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPTestFE Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 The reason we\'re being so quick with the testing is the airplane has to go back to WY to deploy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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