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Aircraft won't back up!!!!


Mt.crewchief
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I think this is a technical question!! More than once at CRB my plane couldn't back out of the revetment with a full load. After many tries, Ariel Port would show up and take some of the load off and then it would make it out like usual and then it would have the removed cargo reloaded and all was good. I always wondered what caused that to happen. I guess I never asked or never received the answer I was looking for. I saw this happen to other planes also, so I assumed it was kind of normal! Was it just a weight issue or did it have something to do with temperatures or air density etc.?

If I remember right, tow vehicle would fit through the opening in the revetment and possibly I saw a plane or two backed out that way.

Does it still happen or was that just a Viet Nam era thing?

I know it may seem like a dumb question, but I have never been where I could ask that question before I found this forum!!

Thanks for your answers,

Ken

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It's a weight/heat/wind thing. Back during OIF, we had crews at one particular slightly forward location that had bog downs and other issues because the airplanes can't back in those conditions. They were nosed into parking and just couldn't deal with it. One crew had their loadmaster nearly completely close the ramp and door (the ramp was open enough to see behind the airplane) and they were able to back out that way. Odd and not great, but it worked.

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Just another one of those real fun duties that a loadmaster had on the 130. Always neat to do it when there were people around not expectin' it. Did it once leavin' Warsaw, Poland. I don't recall if we HAD to do it or not, but my AC at the time, one of the best I ever flew with had us do it anyway. I can still see people wavin' their arms and running over to the rail at the terminal to watch it. I would not have been surprised if we had taxied all the way to the runway backwards............... Another fun memory brought back from the cobwebs of time.

"straight back, straight back, a little to the copilot side, straight, clear all around, a little to the pilot's side, that's enough, straight back.' Didn't you have to move forward a bit, before taxiing, to align the main gear again? I recall something to that effect.

Giz.

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Just another one of those real fun duties that a loadmaster had on the 130. Always neat to do it when there were people around not expectin' it. Did it once leavin' Warsaw, Poland. I don't recall if we HAD to do it or not, but my AC at the time, one of the best I ever flew with had us do it anyway. I can still see people wavin' their arms and running over to the rail at the terminal to watch it. I would not have been surprised if we had taxied all the way to the runway backwards............... Another fun memory brought back from the cobwebs of time.

"straight back, straight back, a little to the copilot side, straight, clear all around, a little to the pilot's side, that's enough, straight back.' Didn't you have to move forward a bit, before taxiing, to align the main gear again? I recall something to that effect.

Giz.

Warsaw: Back in the '50s and '60s in the 322/317 at Evreux ,the crew chief was droped off in Copenhagan and the crew took the bird on into Warsaw, then picked the C/C up on the way out and on to the next stop.

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Just another one of those real fun duties that a loadmaster had on the 130. Always neat to do it when there were people around not expectin' it. Did it once leavin' Warsaw, Poland. I don't recall if we HAD to do it or not, but my AC at the time, one of the best I ever flew with had us do it anyway. I can still see people wavin' their arms and running over to the rail at the terminal to watch it. I would not have been surprised if we had taxied all the way to the runway backwards............... Another fun memory brought back from the cobwebs of time.

"straight back, straight back, a little to the copilot side, straight, clear all around, a little to the pilot's side, that's enough, straight back.' Didn't you have to move forward a bit, before taxiing, to align the main gear again? I recall something to that effect.

Giz.

Warsaw: Back in the '50s and '60s in the 322/317 at Evreux ,the crew chief was droped off in Copenhagan and the crew took the bird on into Warsaw, then picked the C/C up on the way out and on to the next stop.

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Hay Gis I only remember doing it one time in ramstine germany at the time ramstine was a fighter base with small parking spaces. as we were backing up I kept saying left and we kept going to the right . As we were about to back off the blacktop I had to remind the pilot it was his other left (the same as the plane) after that we backed out with no problem . I was not surprized the subject did not come up again everybody kind of just forgot about it.

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When we went to Clark we used the "Fig Leaf" area for our A models. We had no problem backing out of them loaded.

When we backed one with the tug we had to pull it foreward about 5' or so for the MLG shoe pads to be in the rail.

We had lots of problems with those pads.

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We reverse taxi all the time. There was one time at a sandy location on the other side of the world where we had to reverse up a taxiway (C-130H1) to be able to pull into an engine run spot. Due to the heat and weight of the aircraft, we couldn't do it because our oil temps would get too hot. 19,600 is max torque no matter what. The scariest reversing that I have experienced is when I'm doing a PRO1 sortie with a brand new copilot student. I don't know why we qual CPs in the left seat, but we do and one of the most frustrating thing I have to do is sit in the right seat without the tiller while my student who has never flown in a herk before (sim doesn't count) perform multiple touch and goes including a reverse taxi at the end of the sortie. Needless to say, I'm pretty much operating the throttles because the students rarely know what's really going on.

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Hay Gis I only remember doing it one time in ramstine germany at the time ramstine was a fighter base with small parking spaces. as we were backing up I kept saying left and we kept going to the right . As we were about to back off the blacktop I had to remind the pilot it was his other left (the same as the plane) after that we backed out with no problem . I was not surprized the subject did not come up again everybody kind of just forgot about it.

My instructor in CTF, TSGT Prewitt, taught me the pilot-co-pilot thing because he said there was the possibility that there were people on either end of the bus that didn't know their right from their left!!!!!LMAO!!! I wonder what became of him. he did a hellof a job with me, I know that. Kinda related, I know some of you may not believe what I am gonna tell, but it is true>>>> At the end of my enlistment the 36th was on rote to Moldyhole, so I flew with 37 and 38 crews. We were settin' out for five hours around the flag pole, buttoned up, started to taxi, co-pilot calls clear right, and we start turnin LEFT!!!! Somebody, I think the FE said 'The other way", and still we turned more left instead of right. Went forward maybe twenty feet and stopped, called the fix-it guys and shut her down right there. Turned out the nose wheel steering was rigged backwards. Dunno how, but that is what was wrong....... I don't know if it was something the FE could have seen on his pre-flight or what,. I had developed a habit, due to another story, of checkin' the nose gear to see if the lock pin had been pulled before I got on board.. There was nothin' there wrong that I would have known what to look for.

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As an old guy with a short pencil and no eraser on backing when the condition allows the manuever. The tires take a set and its hard to overcome the flat spot on the reversing. I believe the Tq. avail. is only about 6000#

I was always taught to never get yourself into a spot that one couldn't get out.

Next time try this and must be briefed, power the acft. forward to get off the flat spot, then gently go into reverse while the acft. is rolling forward. Works good and have used it many times.

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Thanks for all of the good and interesting replies to my question. At CRB Viet Nam, all or almost all of the C-130's were either parked nose to nose in revetments or earlier, nose to nose without revetments. I do think some of the situations I am talking about were excessive loads and also as Steve said, they were parked too close to allow the fwd then reverse maneuver. I only saw it a few times considering I watched the planes back out without troubles for almost three years!!

Now I am going to think up another question to satisfy my CRS relapse!!!!!!!

Thanks,

Ken

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Couple backing stories and one fwd. movement one. Back when Ramstein was a sleepy F-102 base with narrow taxiways snaking through the woods we were trying to get back to the main ramp. This involved backing down a slight incline to a T intersection. The LM was busy doing something else so I ended up lying on the closed ramp with ramp door open attempting to help the AC out of the maze. As we were backing down hill the acft. begain to pick up speed. At the same time we were approaching the taxiway intersection. We were going too fast to make the turn so I advised the AC we should perhaps slow down a bit. And we did, but not enough. At that point there was probably some urgency in my voice and as a result the AC applied too much brake. As I watched, the pavement begain to get closer and closer, and I thought we were going to set the acft. on its tail. Didn't happen and soon we were back on the main ramp.

In the middle of a moonless night we were backing on a very tiny hardstand at Sembach AB. Everthing seemed normal so as the crew waited I quickly secured the acft and we went to quarters. However, the next morning did we get a big surprise. Had we backed another 15/20 feet we would have been right at the edge of a steep drop off. As it was the tail was over the abyss.

In my B-47 days about three weeks of each month was spent on 15 minute alert. Normal procedure was to rotate tires on every crew change. On this particular tour as I would get a new crew they would ask me if the acft. was in good shape and did the tires need rotated. Not knowing any better, I responded all is good. Soon thereafter we had a scramble that required the acft. to taxi to the runway, advance power to takeoff after which they would return to the alert area and recock. On my acft. after starting engines I gave the signal ready to taxi. The power was advanced higher and higher but the tires were so flat spotted the acft. would not move. So the AC begain to rock the acft. and at last it begain to move. I thought the wings were going to break off as the acft. taxied off the stub. I can tell you for sure, after that when tire rotation was due I saw that it was accomplished.

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 4 weeks later...

Yes I have seen this problem many times and it is a fairly easy fix. Sit in the Pilot seat facing a generally forward direction. Fully depress the brake pedals while simultaneously pushing the small yellow lever approx 10 inches adjacent to your right knee in towards the flight deck floor. You will hear a clunk as the handle fully returns to it's resting position. If this fails to rectify the problem, gain access to the left and right side of the fuselage approximately in line with the front and rear main landing gear tires. As you look towards the ground you will notice a wooden or rubber device approximately 2 feet long, 6 inches high and 6 inches wide, generally painted yellow or some other high visibility color with a 1 inch diameter cord or rope attached. In one swift movement, pull the device towards you in a sweeping motion and store in the cargo compartment. Hopefully this advice has been helpful.

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