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Rzouga

QEC DIFFERENCE

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Hello herky people;

I want to know what is the difference between QEC mounted on -7B engines(B model) and those mounted on -15 engines(H model).

Otherwise, what should be made to the QECs mounted on -7 engines to be compatible for -15 engines?

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Or are you asking to take the internal engine and move it from one nacelle to another nacelle?

That one would be hard to answer without having all the nacelle drawings and you would be best contacting Rolls Royce or an approved overhaul facility to answer that one.

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In 1983 while working at Lockheed we built 9, H models for the U.S. Coast Guard and they were known as C-130 H-7's because the Coast Guard couldn't afford -15 engines, they sent us used GFE -7 engines to be installed. The plan was to upgrade later( which they did ) when money became available. The used -7 were put into new nacelles and hung on the wings and sent on their way. These were prior to the oil cooler augmented engines. Lars book shows first one as C/N 4947. Also while deployed to Germany for Operation Provide Promise in 1993 the engine Queen Bee shop sent a -7 to Split and it was hung on a Maxwell H model aircraft by mistake. ( I described this incident in a post here a few years back) The aircraft engines were ran up and low and behold no 1083 degrees. Engine troops were NOT happy. So unless you are putting an engine with  an augmented oil cooler on a  -7 wing it will fit. Starter button must be held in as hold in circuit is not there on -15 starter system. Bill

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Also as stated in the above post , the max torque on -7 and -15 engines is 19600 inch pounds. The above statement is not an official approval, just my experience. Bill

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1 hour ago, Spectre623 said:

In 1983 while working at Lockheed we built 9, H models for the U.S. Coast Guard and they were known as C-130 H-7's because the Coast Guard couldn't afford -15 engines, they sent us used GFE -7 engines to be installed. The plan was to upgrade later( which they did ) when money became available. The used -7 were put into new nacelles and hung on the wings and sent on their way. These were prior to the oil cooler augmented engines. Lars book shows first one as C/N 4947. Also while deployed to Germany for Operation Provide Promise in 1993 the engine Queen Bee shop sent a -7 to Split and it was hung on a Maxwell H model aircraft by mistake. ( I described this incident in a post here a few years back) The aircraft engines were ran up and low and behold no 1083 degrees. Engine troops were NOT happy. So unless you are putting an engine with  an augmented oil cooler on a  -7 wing it will fit. Starter button must be held in as hold in circuit is not there on -15 starter system. Bill

Weren't they able to bolt the -15s up because they had purchased H-model wings?  

I need to dig through some files to be sure but I thought you HAD to have a certain wing configuration to have -15s

 

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19 hours ago, hehe said:

Or are you asking to take the internal engine and move it from one nacelle to another nacelle?

That one would be hard to answer without having all the nacelle drawings and you would be best contacting Rolls Royce or an approved overhaul facility to answer that one.

Our aircraft was equipped with H model wings. In fact we have -15 engines to be installed on H model aircrafts but we dont have sufficent QEC for those engines. The most QEC we have are for -7 engines.

 

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Ok.  So you are looking to install your -15 cores into some spare -7 nacelles.

Not sure what country you are in but you are gonna want to get some engineers or Rolls Royce repair facilities involved.

Saying something will work and giving you approval to do so are two different things.

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During the Vietnam war,11 E model gunships (69-6567thru 69-6577) had -15 engines installed and deployed to Ubon,Thailand on Oct. 25, 1971 and were called Super E's then later called H's only because of the engine change. The all new cargo H models weren't built till 1974. I used to put Chevy engines in Jeep's even though they didn't have a Chevy frame. 😮Bill

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I just did a brief search on the above subject and found the so called "H" model wings ( actually no such thing as an H model wing per se, just a part number) being built and refitted to most all C-130's flying today are the same as the J model wings except for a few odd and end holes and brackets. The center wing box is the big deal on the C-130 as it takes the full load and stresses during flight. Also read an old post from this site where the " E/H" model Spectre gunship noted above C/N 6576 didn't get it's first "H" model center wing till April 1992, 24 years after it got the -15 engines, says the crew chief of 6576. As far as the outer wings go we got the so called 1039 wings (TCTO 1039) for our 81 H models in the 1990's. These were great cause we could change the fuel probes from the top of the wing without going into the tank. Bottom line -7 and -15 will interchange. Bill

 

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Bill,  I just experienced an "I didn't know that" moment. I didn't know that there were E-model gunships ever!  I guess I just assumed they were all A's at Ubon until the war ended! The last time I was at Ubon was while I was stationed at CCK and was at Ubon for a "down & back" in 1970 . I  had a good friend die when Warlord was shot down in 1970. That was an "A model wasn't it? 

Anyway, now I know something I didn't know before today!  Thanks for the info,

Ken

 

 

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Hello Ken, haven't heard from you on the site for a while. Hope all is well. To answer your question, yes War Lord was an "A" model, 54-1625 and was shot down over the Trail on April 21,1970. All crew 10 crew members lost. Thank God it didn't have all 14 crew members on board. I have the crew list but don't want to print it on the site.

As for the E model gun ships at first they had the same armament as the "A" model. 2, 20mm, 2 ,7.62mm and 2, 40mm cannons. All the E.s had the 105mm cannon by Feb. 1972. Bill

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1 hour ago, Spectre623 said:

I just did a brief search on the above subject and found the so called "H" model wings ( actually no such thing as an H model wing per se, just a part number) being built and refitted to most all C-130's flying today are the same as the J model wings except for a few odd and end holes and brackets. The center wing box is the big deal on the C-130 as it takes the full load and stresses during flight. Also read an old post from this site where the " E/H" model Spectre gunship noted above C/N 6576 didn't get it's first "H" model center wing till April 1992, 24 years after it got the -15 engines, says the crew chief of 6576. As far as the outer wings go we got the so called 1039 wings (TCTO 1039) for our 81 H models in the 1990's. These were great cause we could change the fuel probes from the top of the wing without going into the tank. Bottom line -7 and -15 will interchange. Bill

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.lockheedmartin.com/content/dam/lockheed-martin/aero/documents/sustainment/csc/service-news/sn-mag-v21-v30/V26N01.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj73-Kx85_qAhV_Ap0JHcfhBtEQFjAAegQIBRAC&usg=AOvVaw3JtEhE5zCcv8aDtJaLYXBK

I disagree with your statement on wings.  There are most definitely differences in center wing boxes.  The first T-56-15 and H-model was 64-4852.  If you look up the wing box part numbers, 4852 starts a new part number compared to the E right before it.  

There many variants of the wing boxes.  A Talon 2 does not have the same wing box as a C-130H.  Even the early J-models are already getting new wing boxes installed and replaced with the enhanced service life wing that came from the factory in the HC/MC/AC Js and is also now coming on newer production Js.  

I dont know the exact differences but I think I have a engine-to-wing configuration excel spreadsheet somewhere on my hard-drive that I'll try to find.

I guess my point is that being able to physically bolt up verse the wing being designed to handle it are two different things completely.

I'll also try to look up the AC-130E/H wing box thing.  I was under the impression that they received wing work during that conversion.

 

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Hi there Mr. hehe. If you reread my post you will see that I said the FIRST all new CARGO C-130H was built in 1974. Also EVERYONE knows that all HC-130H's had -15 engines except the 11 H-7's we built as I describe in the above posts..

Also you posted the wrong tail number it is 64-14852 not 64-4852. Have a nice day. 😑

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No one called it 14852, I worked on that plane and deployed with it multiple times, it was just 4852, sure technically its 14852 and I'm sure you'll reference Lars book.  Dont bother, I took over Lars work and updated it to 2020.  I'm well aware of it.  But anyway

The discussion was -15 verse wing.  That's why I referenced 4852.

I'll pull engineering drawings and make sense of it when I get the time.

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Posted (edited)

Wow...I wait with baited breath Mr. hehe. Bill

Edited by Spectre623
new wording

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1 hour ago, Spectre623 said:

Wow...I wait with baited breath Mr. hehe. Bill

Its bated......but here is an article to keep you entertained in the wait.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.sikorskyaerospace.com/content/dam/lockheed-martin/aero/documents/sustainment/csc/service-news/sn-mag-v21-v30/V30N02.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjg-43Lu6DqAhWlJzQIHQZrACs4ChAWMAF6BAgFEAE&usg=AOvVaw185m2aY2D85o0JddOqTh_1

To say you could bolt -15s on a -7 equipped aircraft might have been true in 1970s but not now........

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Excellent article Mr. hehe and yes it does confirm my forth post on this subject that all new center wings are built to the "J" model specs except for a few different holes brackets etc. as required for the different models they are used on. No it is baited and you took it. Have a nice day Mr. hehe. 😄 Bill

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Think what you want Shakespeare.  The article is from 2005 which is probably around the time you lost your relevancy on the subject.

Even Js are already getting replacement wings bud.

To the original poster, contact a Rolls Royce facility or MRO.  Like I said before, saying something can work verse approving you to do it are not the same thing.

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Thanks to all of you, and we will contact Rolls Royce or any MRO facility to get the approval.

Thanks Gentelmen.....

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1 hour ago, Rzouga said:

Thanks to all of you, and we will contact Rolls Royce or any MRO facility to get the approval.

Thanks Gentelmen.....

I wish I had a good phone number for a Rolls Royce rep or MRO in your country that could help.

If you can't find someone, you can always call the Lockheed Hercules Help Line at 770-494-9131

They should be able to at least get you in contact with someone or maybe even provide guidance on your engine nacelle swap

Best of luck to you

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