fltsload Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 From the AFA news: The Air Force has awarded L-3 Communications a $61 million contract to add a weapons package to eight MC-130W Combat Spear special-mission aircraft to give them a gunship-like attack capability. Under the terms of the deal, L-3 will provide the weapons kits, which are called "precision strike packages," for installation on the aircraft at Warner Robins Air Logistics Center in Georgia. MC-130Ws fitted with the weapons will be known as Dragon Spears. Air Force Special Operations Command is arming these aircraft to relieve the relentless operational demands on its regular AC-130 gunships until new AC-130Js enter the fleet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPTestFE Posted September 28, 2010 Share Posted September 28, 2010 I saw at least two of the MC-Ws already being modified with this back in March at the facility in Waco. Supposed to be converting the old valve housing to the new EVH as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookychief Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 From the AFA news: The Air Force has awarded L-3 Communications a $61 million contract to add a weapons package to eight MC-130W Combat Spear special-mission aircraft to give them a gunship-like attack capability. Under the terms of the deal, L-3 will provide the weapons kits, which are called "precision strike packages," for installation on the aircraft at Warner Robins Air Logistics Center in Georgia. MC-130Ws fitted with the weapons will be known as Dragon Spears. Air Force Special Operations Command is arming these aircraft to relieve the relentless operational demands on its regular AC-130 gunships until new AC-130Js enter the fleet. Where is this AC-130J info coming from? The last i heard that and the C-27 project were scrapped due to funding and the J model not being able to support the structual demands by the guns.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyChief Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 AC-130Js were being talked up the entire time I was on A4 staff....I understand that this is getting closer and closer to reality. Spookychief..don't assume that any future AC-130J will have the same weapons package that is on the H's or U's. Most likely the weapon package would be a spiral development from what they've already accomplished on the Dragon Spear. You are correct that structural issues exist even today on the legacy gunships and the fuselage structure of the -130J is basically the same as when the H-models came off the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookychief Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 That makes sense I know they are working on a hybrid composite prop with the legacy and the composite because the J props shatter to easy. Will be interesting to see where it all goes. But I think the AC's still have time and won't be going anywhere soon. Ive had the opportunity to work on the Dragon Spear too (recently) and as it comes out of its infantcy it will be a helpful asset Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Railrunner130 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 While I'm not in that community, it seems to me that the ACs get the snot beat out of them. Between the stresses of max weight takeoffs and the weapons firing, I could see them not necessarily timing out early, but developing cracks and such at an earlier age. To me, the J-model platform would seem a good step up with the higher performance engines and the composite, higher altitude prop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 That makes sense I know they are working on a hybrid composite prop with the legacy and the composite because the J props shatter to easy. Will be interesting to see where it all goes. But I think the AC's still have time and won't be going anywhere soon. Ive had the opportunity to work on the Dragon Spear too (recently) and as it comes out of its infantcy it will be a helpful asset Where do you hear that the J props shatter too easily? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Is "delaminate" a better word? I heard that there were some improvements, but don't know how much improvement was achieved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3_Super_Bee Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 the J model not being able to support the structual demands by the guns.... You'll have to explain that one... The "J" has the same fuselage as the legacy Hercs. Not to mention an upgraded wing box was started with the first HC/MC "J", and is currently being used for all "J" models and Legacy wing replacement kits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lkuest Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Might have something to do with gutting a $66 mil airplane instead of a $34 mil airplane. You can basically have 2 H-model airframes available for gunship mod to the J-model's 1. The U Gunship modification itself probably costs over $150 mil, so the extra for a J may seem like a drop in the bucket anyway. I dunno. Food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jansen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 You'll have to explain that one... The "J" has the same fuselage as the legacy Hercs. Not to mention an upgraded wing box was started with the first HC/MC "J", and is currently being used for all "J" models and Legacy wing replacement kits. I suspect that the long test period for the MC-130Js is to determine how the new CWBs hold up. If the MC-130Js do well, an AC-130J order should come quickly. I know that the Dragon Spear and Harvest HAWK programs are being watched very closely. Conversion of H-models doesn't make sense. You would need to AMP the birds, and SOCOM would rather get the range and speed of the Jay birds. Why spend $150 million on an old airframe that isn't as capable? The limiting factor was the early wear issue, which has now (hopefully) been fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Herk Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 I suspect that the long test period for the MC-130Js is to determine how the new CWBs hold up. If the MC-130Js do well, an AC-130J order should come quickly. I know that the Dragon Spear and Harvest HAWK programs are being watched very closely. There's nothing to determine about the "new" CWB - they're not new. They've been around for a couple decades on the SOF fleet. They are a known quantity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jansen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 There's nothing to determine about the "new" CWB - they're not new. They've been around for a couple decades on the SOF fleet. They are a known quantity. My understanding is that the new EL CWB is not quite the same as the old SOF CWB. Some durability enhancements were incorporated into the C-130H production center wing in the early 1990s following the design of the SOF center wing, starting with 5306. These were specific improvements to local areas of the center wing; while improving the durability of those local areas, it did not significantly affect the overall service life of the center wing. The C-130J production line used this wing until recently. Apparently some other improvements have been integrated into the SOF wing to become the new EL CWB. But I don't know exactly what they are and what effect they have. Although the stronger CWB should help, I don't know how much test data there is with the Allison engines. Of course there are a lot of other mods made to the MC-130J, and those will be have to be evaluated as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3_Super_Bee Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 My understanding is that the new EL CWB is not quite the same as the old SOF CWB. Apparently some other improvements have been integrated into the SOF wing to become the new EL CWB. But I don't know exactly what they are and what effect they have. Something with the Rainbow Fittings was changed, not sure what else. I'll see if I can come up with the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jflimbach Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 About time. Interestingly enough, part of this concept was demonstrated at YPG in Dec 2002 - Jan 2003 on a civilian "A" model, N118TG (ex-USAF 57-0512). Check out the following link for info and videos. http://www.1370th.org/rc130/512/512.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Wilson Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 I was under the impression that the J's had the standard CWB (not the beefed up beastie but standard trash hauler stuff) for the first several years of production before the incorporated the SOF style/type CWB. But I am in no way a J expert, that's just what I have read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Herk Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I was under the impression that the J's had the standard CWB (not the beefed up beastie but standard trash hauler stuff) for the first several years of production before the incorporated the SOF style/type CWB. Dan - true until about a year or two ago. The SOF CWB is now the "standard" CWB for all Herks, AFAIK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yawdamper Posted March 6, 2011 Share Posted March 6, 2011 The ESL wing that is currently the standard, is a derivative of the SOF center wing. Beefed up Corner fittings, rainbow fittings and the stringers on the upper and lower panels are thicker. One difference from the SOF was the elimination of the Titanium web at BL 61. Sof required this to get the strength and fit within the existing envelope of the FS 517 beam. Current ESL uses a thicker Aluminum web that fits behind a redesigned FS 517 beam. Ships 5306 and up already have this beam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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