Jump to content
Aero Precision provides OEM part support for military aircraft operators across more than 20 aircraft
Sign in to follow this  
jbob

JATO mount points

Recommended Posts

On another forum I frequent an aviation nugget discussion is going on. One of the questions was about the number of T-handles on the herk. In the discussion someone asked about the JATO T-handles which in turn question which Herks have them. Some Navy/Marine experienced people seemed to say they had mount points on later Herks. Late model Marine Tankers?

I was mostly under the assumption they quit putting them on the Herks with the "H" models but I can't remember if they were there on the FY73 Hs or the FY74 Hs. AFAIK none of the H2s or later had them with the exception of the LCs. Correct?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Helped build 4 LC-130H's while at Lockheed in 83-84 time frame and they did have the JATO mounts. Our 81 model H2's at Dobbins did not. Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the FY 1974 H-models we had at Dyess AFB were the first USAF ones to come from the factory without the JATO attachments. Been a long time -- that's why I prefaced this post with "I think."

Don R.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After about 15 min. of research in Lars book and the gallery on this great website I have found this info. If you look at some of the several pics of selected build numbers and tail numbers you can see which Herks have the JATO mounts as per JBobs question. Bill,

4528 USCG 74 H model Has JATO mts.

4543 USAF 73-1581 H model Has JATO mts.

4585 USAF 74-1659 H model No JATO mts.

4677 USMC 160017 R model Has JATO Mts.

5109 KC-130 8409 T model Has JATO mts.

Edited by Spectre623

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So it would seem the AF in their infinite wisdom chose to purchase later model Herks minus JATO mount points. How much do you wanna bet they probably paid more to buy them without? lol I am wondering now if the J's delivered to the Marines include them as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jbob, using the same high tech system as mentioned above, the answer is "No" the USMC J models do not have JATO mounts. I guess the J's with the big motors and new fangled props are all the power the Marines need. I can believe it as I saw a Lockheed Flight demo in England several years ago and it put to rest ANY doubt in my mind that the J needed any more power. I could not believe the stunts they made that Herk do and not fall out of the sky. Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you check 5509c in the gallery, it appears that the USMC J-models do not have JATO racks. In fact, I did a random check of a lot of international J-model photos and I'd bet that there are none equipped for JATO.

I read a few years ago that the JATO bottles were not even being produced anymore. I read it on the Internet, so it's gotta be true.

An interesting sidenote -- Mexicana Airlines had 3 or 4 Boeing 727's equipped with JATO mount points.

Don R.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The H2s didn't have JATO attachments. We were told by Lockheed the LC-130H models attachment points were put on the wheel well blisters and could not be jettisoned in flight. When the NY ANG took over the Antarctica mission from the Navy they took in some of the Navy LCs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Dave , I think the people told you wrong. I helped build the first 4 LC-130H models the NY Air guard got and they have the macdaddy JATO mounts on the air deflector doors. Check out the first H they got in the gallery. It is Lockheed sn. 5007. 3 very clear pics and one with the bottles attached. And for the best action photo see sn. 5016e in the gallery! :) Bill

Edited by Spectre623

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The H2s didn't have JATO attachments. We were told by Lockheed the LC-130H models attachment points were put on the wheel well blisters and could not be jettisoned in flight. When the NY ANG took over the Antarctica mission from the Navy they took in some of the Navy LCs.

I think Bill answered your post already but Yes the 109th got three ex Navy LCs. I flew the first one out of AMARC to WACO to get it crossdecked. Then later flew the FCF on that one after all the mods were done. The 109th got one FY73 and two FY 76 models. Funny thing though. After we had FCFd #1 we then found out the Navy had not yet modified the outer wings yet. So they had to get new modified wings and do a wing swap which required another FCF.

And to answer Bills post if I'm not mistaken the LCs do NOT have the capability to Jettison the bottles. It's been a while since I flew with them but if I remember correctly they just left the bottles on after burn out since most of their actual ice missions are short flights. So the added drag is not an issue. Plus I wanna say they had one come off once during the burn and did some damage. So to prevent this they eliminated the internal releases.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I was with Evergreen Int. back in the early 80s, our DC-9-30s had attachments for ATO bottles. Never spoke with any of our crews that had actually made an ATO in the 9, but then again you never knew with that company. The 9 was right rickey tick on take-off so it must have been an amazing ride with bottles going.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The H2s didn't have JATO attachments. We were told by Lockheed the LC-130H models attachment points were put on the wheel well blisters and could not be jettisoned in flight. When the NY ANG took over the Antarctica mission from the Navy they took in some of the Navy LCs.

The physical mounts were not on the H-2's on the air deflector doors but all the wiring for the bottles was installed. All the way thru to the Flight Deck just no control box or control panel. The wiring is there and the same with the H-3's... Done that way in case you wanted to mount them you just had to install the boxes and the replace the Air Deflector doors.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone here ever experience a JATO personally? If so, can you describe the feeling? Thanks

Sparks, that's a good question. I have seen them used at an Air Show at Naha and one other time but never knew anybody on board!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

Anyone here ever experience a JATO personally? If so, can you describe the feeling? Thanks

I sat in the center escape hatch bubble for a Blue Angles' JATO take-off at Dayton Airshow, 20 Jul 1996 (C-130G 151891 c/n 3878). It is a distant memory now but I remember a pretty good kick when the bottles fired and negative Gs when we nosed over at the top of the climb. The thing that is etched in my memory is looking aft at the tail and watching the runway shrink as we climbed. It reminded me of something you would see in a fighter video.

I had my video camera with me on the trip but didn't bring it on the ride. I thought that would be in a troop seat and therefore thought that there would be nothing to film. Man was I wrong! At least I have a recording of the take off from a television broadcast. If I can find the VHF tape and if the tape is still good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone here ever experience a JATO personally? If so, can you describe the feeling? Thanks

Two ways to use it; the FUN Airshow way and the NOT so fun heavy short field takeoff way...

So the "FUN" way is to have a very light aircraft say 105-110K. Set MAX power, keep the aircraft on the ground until NWS 139 or as long as you dare (not to exceed 139) Rotate the aircraft 35-40 degrees gear FIRE the bottles up hold obstacle clearance speed and hold on!

Pretty fun the first time because you have someone "watching" what you should be watching instead of sporting a $h1t-eating grin. (Where did that saying come from? Google here I come!)

The "speed" illusion is very cool and after TO the altimeter blasts through 1500' then back to reality...

Not so fun way. So the previously mention "speed illusion" is GONE, set MAX power FIRE the bottles, get up to speed (finally) and normal takeoff...

The bottles only burn for 12-15 secs so not as long as you would think or like...

If they burned longer you may not be able to stop if needed. (8,000 LBS of thrust) They just get you to speed faster...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The JATO bottle supply is running out and none have been produced for quite a while. That's why Fat Albert stopped doing JATO takeoffs in 2009.

I believe the LCs still use them when necessary on the snow, but they are seeking an alternative. On skis, sometimes they don't have enough power to accelerate up to takeoff speed so they need the extra thrust. In fact, that was the driver for testing the 8-bladed props (NP2000): The extra takeoff power would eliminate the need for JATO.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]3985[/ATTACH]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is kinda, more than obvious, now, in my old age, but I seem to remember, (1966-1970 time frame 346th lm) tho, I never was on board for a jato take off, but I do remember, more than several 'discussions' regarding pulling the T handles to release the spent bottles that you must do from the bottom up....... I seem to recall that in the '60's time frame that there were incidents where the jato bottles had come loose, either by accident, or pulling the 'T' handles in the wrong order.... Weird things that come back to you ~50 yrs later... BUT don't ask me what I had for breakfast...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm surprised none of our 109th or old VXE-6 guys have responded with personal experience yet. I was able to make a ski landing and takeoff in Greenland with the 109th back during my HHQ days but no ATO usage. One of the things I learned was they will not fire the bottles unless they can get the nose ski off the ground. If they cannot accelerate to that speed at least they will not use them. Too much drag with the nose ski.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...