HercRep Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 OK guys, I know the Herc can be flown with the APU removed, does anyone remember where the guidance is to do so? W/B adjustments, block-off panels, ect? MESM only speaks to flight with APU inop. I hate this getting old thing,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herky400M Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Hi, look into the loadies manual -5, otherwise leave the broken one on the plane so no problems with WB, but we have to fly VMC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve haigler Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 The old 55-130 which is an AFI today, day VMC sticks in my head. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC10FE Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 but we have to fly VMC. VMC? If I remember correctly, the APU on the commercial Herc (the same one that's on the military C-130) is not certified for use inflight. I tried to find it in my old 382 AOM, but couldn't find the notation. Don R. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenten Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 1- All of our commercial registered airplanes are equipped with APU, but restricted for ground operation only. Quoting: OM 382G-65C (Sec2 page 162) “CAUTION” Do not operate the APU during take-off or in flight. 2- No point on to fly VMC only if APU cannot be used in-flight. (If related avionic instruments (GYROs) are operable before the mission). 3- Basically the APU on military airplane is used during flight for two in-flight emergencies: During electrical fire and during the loss or suspected malfunction of the Ess Ac Bus. The concepts are to reduce the load on Ess Ac Bus if the high load is suspected to be the cause and/or to use a deferent routing bath for feeding the Ess Ac Bus). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticFox Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 No APU = flight required in VMC conditions only, and with no known electrical malfunctions. According to the good book, the APU may or may not start at or above an altitude of FL20. Instead of the door opening to 35* (as it does on the ground) it will only open to 15*. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDizzle Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 No APU = flight required in VMC conditions only, and with no known electrical malfunctions. According to the good book, the APU may or may not start at or above an altitude of FL20. Instead of the door opening to 35* (as it does on the ground) it will only open to 15*. Same with the ATM generator. You can fly without it but only on day VMC with no other problems. This is because the APU/ATM are backup electrical sources for a few emergency procedures. I believe for weight and balance purposes it's any equipment change over 5lbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenten Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Seems “some good books” are not updated concerning flying without APU generator and the VMC restriction issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victorp1 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 The additional restriction is placed on by the operator/operator. USAF has their restrictions for day VFR, USNR and USMC have their restrictions but I don't know what their local 3710 dictates. When I was active duty Navy we had no restriction. The Lockheed Flight Manuals for the C-130H and the FAA Approved Flight Manual (AFM) for the commercial L-382E/G have no requirement for a APU. Along with what tenten stated, the AFM has in the limitations section "Do not operate the APU during takeoff or in flight". Also, as stated earlier you should adjust your weight and balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenten Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 Thanks victorp1 for clearing up the point; so it is an individual operator restriction (MEL) and might be based on some extra equipment added in some aircrafts. NOTE: The FAA (MMEL) rev.18 dated 1994, and the Belgian air force (MEL) dated JUL 2003, along with our (MEL) allowing us to fly/dispatch the aircraft without APU/ATM generator with NO issue of VMC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KJamison Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Am I reading this wrong or is the original question "Can you fly with the APU removed". Not inop. Actually taken out of the aircraft and the aircraft flown. Are you guys quoting the same regs for APU inop without looking at bleed air problems, open electrical, pressurization, weight and balance (kinda addressed) etc. I could be reading it wrong or reading the responses wrong. You know how the internet can be. I have never heard of a plane flying with an open cavity where the APU should be. That area stays slightly pressurized from the small scoop at the bottom but is purged by the venturi of the exhaust stack. If that area was open....? Who knows. I don't. It would be interesting if some one has done this before. I will ask a depot friend tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC10FE Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 A little off the subject, but still APU related. Some Herc operators modified their airplanes with an APU from a 727. It was kind of a "Rube Goldberg" contraption and was wired like the GTC in that it could not be started in flight. I don't know how many were modified this way or how many are still around. Transafrik's 5X-TUF has the 727 APU. The -20 in the attached photo crashed in Angola in November 1989 while being operated by Tepper Aviation. The Belgians and a few other countries, also modified their early H's with a new APU. I don't remember who the manufacturer is, but it appears to be able to operated in flight. Don R. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDizzle Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 taken out of the aircraft and the aircraft flown For USAF planes the vol3 says we cannot fly without things that are required for emergency procedures. Is the APU required for any EPs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenten Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 KJamison, We apologize for not having the direct answer to brother HercRep. Until tomorrow; no harm to discuss one of the major affect of flying without APU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HercMX Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 (edited) In '71 we removed the GTC and loaded it in the cargo compartment along with other pieces of scrap.. An E model had been damaged with a satchell charge placed on the left fwd main blowing away left side of the acft.. Hoses were capped, bleed air capped, tires replaced and the area scabbed over with full sheets of T3... Buddy started and flown to the PI from SVN.......... Edited April 29, 2011 by HercMX incomplete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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